[00:27:09]

Alexander: Was the treatment of the people who employed you different in Germany than in Canada?

Alma: Yes, I think it was a bit different. They were – also because we were just refugees there – I noticed that they didn’t, they didn’t; here one didn’t notice or it didn’t feel as if they saw us as, “refugees,” they never told us “You’re just refugees,” or so. I must say that honestly, I tell you the way it is, right. There [in Germany?] they looked at us, us refugees, right? And then they came here and… But here you had to do all the bad work too. Yes, you had to do that too. In the second household, I didn’t have to work that hard. There I had it easier, yes. There, on the farm, it was especially [hard], I just left, it became too hard for me. 

[phone rings]

Al.2.1.a

[00:30:50]

Alma: [...] The man from the first household told me he would give me more [wages], he had told me he would give me more, that after three months, he would pay me more. Once those three months were up, he didn’t give me more, well, those were rather poor Jews already, they were starting a new life as well — had a small room, there he started his business, a family as well. But the Jews are, they have, I noticed that, they stuck together very well. The rich helped the poor — so that they could make their way as well. I liked it very much there, that’s why. They all helped each other. 

 [...]

Alma: Yes, they were newcomers, they had just arrived, well, after — Where they had been [during] Holocaust, I don’t know either, but they were there.

Alexander: Do you know why they hired you?

Alma: I don’t know. They needed – I don’t know, I never found out. 

Alexander: Did your aunt know them?

Alma: My aunt? - Yes. I think she knew; she knew where it was. Here there were many such households, they were many. German Jews were here, and these were Hungarian Jews and Czech Jews, where I was, they all knew German. There wasn’t a single one who didn’t know German. Yes, they all knew. A few Austrian Jews were here, too. The rich ones had all come before the war.

Alexander: How did the family treat you?

Alma: Quite well.

Alexander: As a member of the family or rather as an employee?

Alma: Rather as an employee. Yes, not as a member, no, neither of them.

Alexander: Where, for example, did you eat?

Alma: Alone.

Alexander: In the kitchen? 

Alma: Yes, in the kitchen.

Alexander: How did you feel about that?

Alma: In the first household, the poorer one, they ate in the kitchen as well. But I had to make breakfast for the kids, and then I ate together with the kids, together, with them. And then, he [the man of the house] had to leave, and she ate by herself, sometimes she got out of bed at ten o’clock.

Alexander: She was home the whole day?

Alma: She was there the whole day. And I did that stuff there. And when she was up, she looked after her baby, her two kids, played etc. Went for a ride with the buggy, and I did the household for her. Did the laundry here, vacuumed and wiped off dust, but I didn’t go into her bedroom, she said, that she will do it herself, but I worked in all the other rooms. Mainly worked for the children. And the second job again–

[...]

Alexander: How was your interaction with the woman?

Alma: Uhmm, good. Yes.

Alexander: Did you talk to her during the day?

Alma: No, we didn’t talk that much. She went her way. She did the cooking, and the shopping by herself. They cooked differently than the others. They were, they had, well, how do you say, made different food, stuff, only with milk, they needed to have different pots and so, and I could not figure it out. There, I came into conflict. Several times she told me that I wasn’t to take that towel for that and so. Thought to myself, “My God, what’s the difference.” That had to do with religion. What that is, I don’t know.

Alexander: The kosher cooking.

Alma: Yes, kosher and... yes, for the kids they even brought bacon, then he told me, I had to fry bacon for the kids every few days. And with a very different pan, a very different towel, and a very different dishwashing water — dishwashing, yes. It’s interesting, isn’t it? But then, well, then I left… And in the other households it was never like this.

Alexander: How did that happen? Did she tell you in a normal tone?

Alma: Yes, she told me, I should use the plaid, she put it up for me — well, this is the blue plaid, that I should use for the greasy stuff and the other with the milk stuff and so the other, that was again a different colour, that she put and that just wouldn’t go into my head, and I mixed it up once in a while. So, she taught me how to do it right. But I did it wrong again. But I can’t say they were bad to me.

Alexander: And the husband, how did he treat you?

Alma: He treated me quite well. When I gave him the notice, I had talked about it with my aunt: “Oh,” she said – my aunt already knew about the other household, she knew that they were looking for somebody too, a housemaid. So she said, “Don’t stay there, in this other one you just have one child, there you have three to look after.” She said, “Go on again”. And the other gave me more money right away.

Al.2.1.b

[00:13:22]

Alexander: What did your family say about that [moving to Canada]?

Alma: Nothing. They didn’t have anything either. They also worked there, all of them. Didn’t say anything, no, they said nothing; I was the first to come here. My father said: “Go, go.” He had been, I think in 1913 - no, he was in America for thirteen years. When he was a young man. He was supposed to be drafted into the Russian army, that was when the Russians were still in Poland, again, in those years. And so, he fled, he didn’t want to go into the army. He was in Germany for one year, in Harburg, near Hamburg, where he earned a lot of money, himself, to pay for the boat trip to New York... He lived in Cleveland, in Chicago, before.

And once he told me, “I can’t help you, I can’t give you anything,” he was an old man then, “I can’t help you, you can see yourself, we don’t have anything, lost everything in Poland. Go out.” So, I went to his sister [her aunt]. [My parents] Had nothing against it. They didn’t regret it either. He said he had been in America for so long, and he had liked it before the war, yes. Worked hard too, but...

Alexander: What did your mother say when you left?

Alma: Ah, mother had, like every mother, a hard time. But I let her come here, when we were already married, in this house, already had two young children, and then my husband let them both come stay with us for a year. And my father was at ease here [in Canada] — he was able to read the newspaper, was able go everywhere, but my mother wasn’t. So, my mother usually stayed in with me.

 Alexander: How was your relationship with your mother?

 Alma: Good. Yes. Oh, yes, yes. Yes, when she was already old and sick, my husband always let me go home to my mother, to visit. Yes, I have been home probably six times. 

Alexander: Did you ever miss your mother when you left?

Alma: Oh yes. I missed all of them. I just never wanted to show that directly, but I did miss them, yes. 

Alexander: Why did you not want to admit that?

Alma: Didn’t quite want to admit that. They asked me then, “How do you like it?” — my relatives. “Well, I like it.” They were nice, and treated me well, my relatives were no problem. I’m still in touch with them, with my cousins. 

Alexander: And why didn’t you want to show that [you missed your family]? 

Alma: I didn’t want to, I thought I’m already an adult, twenty years old already, don’t want to make a fuss, didn’t want to wail. There were several others, I wasn’t alone, and the others didn’t fare any better.

Al.3.1.a